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Stealthr4v3r
Mother Superior


Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 3113
Location: West Chester, PA

PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 2:30 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Uty wrote:

My point has always been this: I eat meat, I wear leather, and I more than likely use products that have been tested on animals. I have no right to be outraged by animal cruelty until I make the appropriate lifestyle changes.



And my point is that I reserve the right to make completely arbitrary and irrational judgments Razz
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x23kitten
The Happiest Girl in the World


Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 190
Location: new brunswick

PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 5:53 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Quote:
I have no right to be outraged by animal cruelty until I make the appropriate lifestyle changes.

so would that also mean you have no right to be outraged over the holocaust unless you were jewish? or black? or a gypsy? or gay? so because i'm none of those things in your logic it would be wrong of me to be outraged?
certain aspects of society are hard to seperate yourself from and thats unfortunate. you can be upset over eating meat and still eat it without betraying yourself- or wearing leather for that matter.
also i've worked with cows, and they do have personality. no they aren't the smartest animals, but they aren't stupid and they have visible emotions. i still eat meat. also i wouldnt have a problem with going to a slaughter house, because i know that humans are placed above animals. the desire to help people comes before helping animals in this world.
if you want to put your energy behind a cause i would also avoid PETA. they are bad people and liars about their ability to help animals. you can say i'm heartless for eating meat or wearing makeup, but each animal is fated for differnt things. i worked in a shelter and vets office last year, i will again this year. its not just dogs and cats that come in but i care deeply about each one.
what bothered me about this article was that the dogs were being used for soemthign that wasnt helping society. there was no point to hurting those dogs. ((by the way dogs arn't used for makeup testing anymore)) i'd rater see them use infants for their drug deals honestly no matter how messed up that sounds. but thats another point entirely.

by the way less than a quarter of studies in biomedicine involve animals, and more than 90% of those studies are using mice and rats. also to buy one mouse weighing in at 13-15grams, it costs 13.50$. so people doing studies dont jsut run out and buy animals to test on. it takes two years to get a grant keep that in mind before juding their abilities or movites.

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Stavros
Dimunitive Badass


Joined: 25 Sep 2003
Posts: 1289

PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 6:53 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

uty wrote:
I don't empathise with cows

bjcii wrote:
I will fucking destroy anyone who hurts a dog. I wish I could tell you why, but I don't know myself...

Those crafty Bastards!
article wrote:
If biologists weren't victim to the same blindness that afflicts us all, they probably wouldn't hesitate to classify dogs as social parasites. This is the class of manipulative creatures exemplified by the cuckoo, which lays its eggs in the nest of some unsuspecting dupe of a bird of another species; the poor befuddled parents see this big mouth crying out for food and stuff it full of worms at the expense of their own offspring. Every time they turn their backs, the cuckoo hatchling shoves another of its foster parents' flesh and blood overboard.

Calling dogs parasites is fighting words, but what can I say? Dogs have got us exactly where they want us, and we, idiotic grins fixed to our faces, go along with it all....

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chickiepie
Lifeless Reject


Joined: 05 May 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:43 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

article wrote:
If biologists weren't victim to the same blindness that afflicts us all, they probably wouldn't hesitate to classify dogs as social parasites. This is the class of manipulative creatures exemplified by the cuckoo, which lays its eggs in the nest of some unsuspecting dupe of a bird of another species; the poor befuddled parents see this big mouth crying out for food and stuff it full of worms at the expense of their own offspring. Every time they turn their backs, the cuckoo hatchling shoves another of its foster parents' flesh and blood overboard.

Calling dogs parasites is fighting words, but what can I say? Dogs have got us exactly where they want us, and we, idiotic grins fixed to our faces, go along with it all....



...and we love it! look at the little faces!
Image

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Gannondwarf
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Joined: 13 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:03 am Reply with quoteBack to top

puddlejumpchick wrote:
article wrote:
If biologists weren't victim to the same blindness that afflicts us all, they probably wouldn't hesitate to classify dogs as social parasites. This is the class of manipulative creatures exemplified by the cuckoo, which lays its eggs in the nest of some unsuspecting dupe of a bird of another species; the poor befuddled parents see this big mouth crying out for food and stuff it full of worms at the expense of their own offspring. Every time they turn their backs, the cuckoo hatchling shoves another of its foster parents' flesh and blood overboard.

Calling dogs parasites is fighting words, but what can I say? Dogs have got us exactly where they want us, and we, idiotic grins fixed to our faces, go along with it all....



then again... if you classify dogs as social parasites by saying their god-awful cuteness makes people take care of them, then you have to lump babies in that group... ever wonder why we want to take care of babies? yup... it's because they're just so damn cute... it's a hard-wired behavior for humans to instinctually want to take care of something "cute" and helpless... it ensures that the species will endure...

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bjciii
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Joined: 02 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:52 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Speak for yourself... if I take care of a baby it's because I'm gonna want someone to shovel the damn snow, cut the grass, and rake the leaves while I sit on my ass with beer in hand watching the football game on TV Twisted Evil

Don't call it "upbringing," but refer to it as "grooming."

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Stealthr4v3r
Mother Superior


Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 3113
Location: West Chester, PA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 8:14 am Reply with quoteBack to top

bjciii wrote:

Don't call it "upbringing," but refer to it as "grooming."


I'd tend to use 'conditioning'
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BrianW
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 8:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Then what makes us take care of Pauly Shore?

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DanMeltzer
Zombie Monkey Pirate Pope


Joined: 04 May 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 8:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

I don't think any realistic person (particularly those who have had kids) would ever consider saying babies aren't social parasites. They take your food, your energy, your cash, your time, and they prevent you from doing many of the things you used to enjoy for at least a few years until they grow up and learn that if they act up in public there will be consequences (or if you're a modern parent, until they grow up and learn that if they act up in public they will get exactly what they want and you just stop caring).

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Uty
Tang Soo Techie


Joined: 03 May 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 9:26 am Reply with quoteBack to top

x23kitten wrote:


Uty wrote:
I have no right to be outraged by animal cruelty until I make the appropriate lifestyle changes.


so would that also mean you have no right to be outraged over the holocaust unless you were jewish? or black? or a gypsy? or gay? so because i'm none of those things in your logic it would be wrong of me to be outraged?


Actually by my logic you shouldn't be outraged by the Holocaust if you were on the German payroll at the time. (I.E. directly contributing to the problem.)

I eat meat - animals suffer so this can happen.
I wear leather - animals suffer so this can happen.
I don't check whether the products I buy were tested on animals - animals more than likely suffered so I could buy one of those products.

I think your assertion would follow from mine if I had said "I have no right to be outraged by animal cruelty unless I am an animal."

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BrianW
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 10:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

However, I claim that I do have a right to be disgusted and outraged by Kobe Bryant every time he talks about 'growing up in the ghetto,' when he's from the 2nd wealthiest area of Philadelphia, right on fucking main line!
That douche bag can rot in hell! And I'm pretty sure all of Philly agrees with me on that.

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Stavros
Dimunitive Badass


Joined: 25 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:33 am Reply with quoteBack to top

gannondwarf wrote:
then again... if you classify dogs as social parasites by saying their god-awful cuteness makes people take care of them, then you have to lump babies in that group...
while your right about the cute factor, babies still belong to our social system. They demonstrate an almost complete set human emotions. Dogs exhibit a couple of human like emotions and trick us into believing they possess the lot. The over humanizing of dogs has me worried. Not only does it lead to "doggy" psychiatrists and massage parlors, but it may also reflect a sorry state for human social fullfillment.

uty wrote:
Actually by my logic you shouldn't be outraged by the Holocaust if you were on the German payroll at the time. (I.E. directly contributing to the problem.)
Good thing we gave all that Nazi gold right back to the jews where it belo... oh nevermind.
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